in Beginners, Newbies, Noobz, etc (Moderators: imwjl, TheMayor1)

I think the weight savings is more in theory than in practice.  TLR and UST tires are heavier too.

I do it for the nearly complete reduction in flats.  Repairing a flat isn't any more a big deal if you've got a tubeless set-up, there just may be some mess involved.  The process is exactly the same...I guess you have to remove the valve stem, but that takes a few seconds.  You install a new tube, pump it up and go.

I also like the lower pressure benefits.

I find the initial set-up slight amount mess involved to be completely worth it to go from at least one flat, sometimes 2 flats per ride at Blue Mound to 2 flats (while actually out on the trail) since I switched to tubeless...about 5 years ago.

I am going to get a set of tubeless, as much as anything to quell the curiosity.

But it seems to me to be a lot of trade offs both ways: Juice replaces weight of tube. Less flats overall versus easier and less messy flat repair. Maybe more weight with tubeless if you carry a tube in case of flats. I normally don't carry a tube on smaller rides, just a patch kit. I would prolly carry a tube with either set up on bigger rides.

Flats seem to me to be a matter of using juice in your tires, whether tubeless or not. I run 27 PSI, and I am not exactly svelte, though on higher volume tires. The only issues I have had with flats are when I am not running juice in the tires, with the glaring exception of PBST last year where I had a double pinch flat while running tube only. I am assuming the juice would not have helped my tube with a flat like that, though I bet tubeless would have. That is the only time I have had any issues with pinch flats.

I think the weight savings is more in theory than in practice.  TLR and UST tires are heavier too.

I do it for the nearly complete reduction in flats.  Repairing a flat isn't any more a big deal if you've got a tubeless set-up, there just may be some mess involved.  The process is exactly the same...I guess you have to remove the valve stem, but that takes a few seconds.  You install a new tube, pump it up and go.

I also like the lower pressure benefits.

I find the initial set-up slight amount mess involved to be completely worth it to go from at least one flat, sometimes 2 flats per ride at Blue Mound to 2 flats (while actually out on the trail) since I switched to tubeless...about 5 years ago.

agreed.  since going 2bliss 2 yrs ago, I have yet to flat. .............well almost.  i punctured the rear on Pokerville last summer and noticed a slight loss of tire pressure........enough where I felt it rolling over all those rocks (I LOVE THAT TRAIL).  flipped the bike over and spun the wheel until i found the puncture where stans was juicing out.  normally the stans would fill this immediately, but i was prob just low on sealant. (you gotta add some from time to time)  i simply rotated the puncture to the ground and let the sealant pool to the bottom of the tire.  waited a few min.  hand pumped some air back in the tire and rode that tire for 4 more months and never an issue.  again running non-UST tires  (WTB wolverines)

I have had 2 experiences with tubless.  Setting up tubeless on a TLR rim with tubeless specific tires and stans worked great, no mess, short set up time.  My attempts at "ghetto tubeless" with gorilla tape, a standard rim, and stardard tires resulted in an hour of sweating, swearing, and trying to wipe a bunch of stans goo from my garage floor....couldn't get the bead to seat.  I may give it another go with a different set of tires (wire bead), if that does not work, I'm gone with the "ghetto" method. 

As far as the benefits of tubeless, I can definately notice more traction, a more supple ride, and like the lower psi.  However, it wasn't some great zen like experience that some people make it out to me, IMHO.  Then again, I usually dont get a ton o flats anyhow.

I have had 2 experiences with tubless.  Setting up tubeless on a TLR rim with tubeless specific tires and stans worked great, no mess, short set up time.  My attempts at "ghetto tubeless" with gorilla tape, a standard rim, and stardard tires resulted in an hour of sweating, swearing, and trying to wipe a bunch of stans goo from my garage floor....couldn't get the bead to seat.  I may give it another go with a different set of tires (wire bead), if that does not work, I'm gone with the "ghetto" method. 

I have not done ghetto but I noted one thing that looked odd to me here....I seat the beads (using soapy water and compressor) then pop it out in little one place to add the sealant and reseat (or pour through the stem if you don't want to pop and reseat) which at that point is pretty easy.  Perhaps I'm misreading but it looks like you put sealant in first?

I have not done ghetto but I noted one thing that looked odd to me here....I seat the beads (using soapy water and compressor) then pop it out in little one place to add the sealant and reseat (or pour through the stem if you don't want to pop and reseat) which at that point is pretty easy.  Perhaps I'm misreading but it looks like you put sealant in first?

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Yeah, my mistake--don't do it the way I did.  I did that on the "proper" tubeless set up and it wasn't a problem because the beads seated right up with little trouble. 

Now the more I read about this the more I think about trying it.  I still don't think it suits my riding style though.

Have any of you who do it landed and had the tire loose all it's air? 

I have heard of this and I take a lot of big drops, not so much with my geared bike anymore, but for reference I destroyed 6 rear wheels last year, and one just a few days ago for the first of this summer and first on my mullet.

It seems like maybe a potential crash waiting to happen for me!  I don't need any help with that as I do it on my own enough, only one today though surprisingly!

When I ran tubeless, almost everytime I would 3, 180, or land with the wheel moto whipped out it would burp air.  I was using mavic 823's and tubeless specific AM tires with stans.  I did try it once with a 2.5 minion DH and that one stayed put, but was really heavy.

I just performed my first tubeless switch (front wheel only) last night. I had the tire mounted with a tube, so I did the following:

- deflated the tube
- unseated just one bead
- removed the tube
- installed the Stan's tubeless valve
- juiced up the unseated bead with some tire snot
- hit the pump hard to seat the bead
- unseated the same bead about 10 inches, enough to get two tire levers in and open a gap for the sealant
- poured in 2oz. of Stan's sealant
- hit the pump hard to seat the bead - no compressor was needed either time...I'm just massive with the pump.
- inflated to about 20psi
- rocked/shook the tire all over the place for about 10 minutes, until I didn't hear or see any more leaks.

- checked the tire this morning and it was flat. Bummer. Guess I need to to the rock/shake more? Seems like there were very specific areas where the air was escaping...manufacturing "flaps" on the side of the bead. The Stan's sealant should eventually clog those, right?

So, overall, a success...except for the tire deflating overnight.

Q, in my experience, nothing shakes the stan's around to where it needs to go like riding it. 

My guess is it'll hold pressure long enough to get your first ride in, then it'll hold pressure longer-term.  After the first ride it'll be all sealed up nicely.

Good to know! Thanks. I'm going to leave the tube in the rear for the first ride, just so I don't have to "worry" about two deflated tires mid-ride.  8)

I did a ghetto set up using 24 inch tubes. Muont the tube on the rim and then split it open, mount tire and when all seated up cut off excess. I used presta valves that had removable cores so I could just air up the tire without juice then remove core and put sealant in without breaking the bead, not messy at all. This is a cheap easy way to try tubeless. Problem with this set up is the tube is a one and done, take the tire off for any reason and you need a new tube.

My tip of the day is: if using a new tire, set it up on the rim with a tube first and let it sit a day or two to hold it's shape. Will make setting the bead easier.

My experience: twice I've flatted with tubeless, both times at Blue Mounds, both times had a punture between the nobs that the sealant wouldn't seal up. Installed a tube and I was good to go for the rest of the ride. One other time I hit a rock square on and heard a pfft (that's a shot of air shootting out) as I was wiping out. Picked the bike up expecting a flat tire but only found some sealant on the sidewall and enough air in the tire to finish out the lap.

Good to know! Thanks. I'm going to leave the tube in the rear for the first ride, just so I don't have to "worry" about two deflated tires mid-ride.  8)

The best part of the Stan's valves is the removable  cores!  No need to unseat a bead to add sealant.  Just spin out the core and use the narrow tip on the mini bottle of solution to fill it up! 

Update:  I succesfully did a ghetto tubeless conversion using 1 inch gorilla tape, stans, and a WTB wolverine rear tire on my Jabberwocky.  Rims are rebranded alex rims (I think).  Anyways.....it sealed right up with the floor pump.  I took it out to camrock and southern kettles an no problems so far.  I am running 23 psi.  The key to getting the bead to seat was soapy water on the rim and tire bead.  Also, I installed a tube, inflated it to seat the bead, and then removed it...so when I used the floor pump, I was only seating one side.

I finally found some time to try to set up my tires as tubeless, but so far I am failing miserably. I am using Bontrager Mustang rims (they say TLR on them) with the rim strips and valves I bought from the Trek store. I am working on the rear tire first - it's a Bontrager Jones XR 2.2" that does not say TLR on it. This is the tire that came stock on my 2011 Paragon.

Anyway, I installed the strips and valves, then put on a soapy tire and poured in about two scoops of Stan's. I tried to align the beads in the middle, and have them straddle the valve. Pumping with all my might, I couldn't get the tire to inflate at all, let alone get the beads to pop into place. I am hanging the wheel from a post on the wall, with the valve stem at the 12:00 position. I gave the wheel a slow spin to distribute the sealant, but it's pretty much just pooling at the bottom.

Is the key the missing TLR indication on the tires? Maybe the beads aren't tight enough? I am hoping to borrow my neighbor's compressor tonight, but I'm not confident it will make any difference. If I have to get another tire I will probably just stick with tubes for now.

The compressor will make a huge difference setting the initial bead.  Most folks with compressors will only have fittings to fill schraeder valves so you'll need one of those little screw on adapters. The presta valve stem that you have on there now should have a removable core, if you remove the core it will allow air to rush in faster and make it even easier to get the initial bead set.  Once that bead is set you shouldn't have to worry about using the compressor for subsequent fillings.